Sulaco-class Ship, Alien 3

[Hudson]

Doesn't make any sense for it to just 'hover'.

K...but, think about that:

The process for landing a ship that big would take a lot longer than the process of putting the small incursion team on a smaller craft, or elevator, or some means of getting them to the ground much much faster. I mean, it may be 60 years later, but think Nostromo landing. Sure, that's an uncharted landing and they'd never done it in that place, but that doesn't suggest that it'd take only about 10 seconds for the Patna to just plop down. Is it not a bigger ship than the Nostromo, I can't remember?

And, seriously, they were in a HUGE hurry to get to Ripley in case no one remembers. I mean, they'd been sending facebook messages back and forth what...how many hours in advance? Come on man, there's no way these people would wait for the process of landing that ship when they could just figuratively hope off first and let the ship land while they were running off doing their business on the ground.

[Hieronymus]

Landing the ship might take slightly longer than landing a dropship, but it eliminates the urgency of returning to orbit.  A shuttle would have to land and make the return trip, which might waste more time in total than simply landing the ship.  With the ship on the ground, they could take Ripley aboard and stick her in hypersleep or strap her to an operating table, or even put her in a cage and let the alien hatch on its own.

[deezelboy]

Is it only in the SE?

It's only in the special SE that lurks in my head.  

But, honestly, who's going to shave the dog (and the oxen, and the rabbits, and whatever other livestock they've got down there)?  Are the prisoners really going to care if the animals are itchy?

The CM:TM describes FTL drives as converting a ship's mass into "mirror image" tachyons, mimicking the ship's matter in every respect except for which side of the lightspeed barrier it exists on.  I assumed that, like neutrinos, tachyons would interact only very weakly with tardionic matter (anything moving less than the speed of light).  There's no mention of this mechanism anywhere in the films, of course, but it would obviate the need for additional shielding for interstellar travel.

This would solve the atmopsheric reentry problem, as the ship would be able to shunt back into its tardyonic state within the atmopshere of the planet, presumably at rest and thus with no friction.  When you need to leave, you just shift into the tachyonic state.  You're not losing any energy except during those shifts, which you'd need to do anyway to interact with, um, tardyonic matter.  

But to be honest I really don't like the tachyon idea.  There's little to support it in the films, and much that goes against it (lack of cherenkov radiation, proximity alerts, being able to detect the derelict transmission when presumably in a tachyonic state, etc.).

[SM]

I think aside from an errant shot here or there, isn't Spike cut from the Special Edition?

He's cut entirely from the Special Edition aside from one line of dialogue (depending on the format and region).

K...but, think about that:

The process for landing a ship that big would take a lot longer than the process of putting the small incursion team on a smaller craft, or elevator, or some means of getting them to the ground much much faster. I mean, it may be 60 years later, but think Nostromo landing. Sure, that's an uncharted landing and they'd never done it in that place, but that doesn't suggest that it'd take only about 10 seconds for the Patna to just plop down. Is it not a bigger ship than the Nostromo, I can't remember?

And, seriously, they were in a HUGE hurry to get to Ripley in case no one remembers. I mean, they'd been sending facebook messages back and forth what...how many hours in advance? Come on man, there's no way these people would wait for the process of landing that ship when they could just figuratively hope off first and let the ship land while they were running off doing their business on the ground.

Heironymous pretty much covered it.  If Acheron is anything to go by then you could have a minimum turn around of 2 hours for landing and relaunch.  Better to cut that in half if time is pressing.

[Hudson]

So, they use a smaller ship and land on the surface during the same time that the larger ship is landing to save time arriving at the complex. While the team is doing their business, the Patna finishes it's landing sequence and the smaller ship may return. The team returns to the large ship, or even the smaller ship to rejoin the Patna which is hovering above ground. There's no reason for them to exit the planet in a hurry, nothing is exploding. They don't need to be in space to do the surgery.

[SM]

No one's saying they do.  Considering the nature of the Alien doing any surgery on the ground would be infinitely more sensible.

However you either have a surgical bay on a shuttle, or you have the mothership set down.  If they both take the same time to land, then you might as well land the mothership.

[beckmen]

I still don't see sufficient proof that they landed the Patna at all. That image could be any number of different craft.

[SM]

Don't see any evidence for (or indeed point in) it being another craft.

We see the Sulaco model heading to Fiorina, then again just over the prison.  Why would another craft - which is fecking huge based on what we see on screen - detach from the Patna and travel a few hundred feet to the ground?  Could've saved themselves a lot of trouble and just detched from orbit.

[beckmen]

Well, the Patna wasn't even making a descent during the last shot we see it. I am not trying to argue that it is another ship, I am trying to argue that we don't know what it is. Knowing what we know about the production, it's possible not even Fincher and Company have an answer to that one.

[NERMAL]

I'm quite happy to believe there are struts available at the facility to support the ship as it settles in. It's a mining/smelting facility. Would it not make more sense to load a cargo vessel at the facility to transfer to an orbiting refinery? The bigger the barge, the more cost effective the process. Therefore the necessity for landing struts to accomodate such vessels.

I also think any tech that generates artificial gravity inside a vessel can be modified to counter outside gravity as required with sufficient resources available. The Nostromo would not be able to land and lift off again on jets/rockets alone regardless off the 0.8G gravity. Even if the Nostromo was on jets and rockets alone, keep in mind there is a 57 year technology gap between the Nostromo, a lowly tug boat, and the Patna, a company funded executive cruiser.

[Hudson]

I still don't see sufficient proof that they landed the Patna at all. That image could be any number of different craft.

It really looks like the antenna array on the right side sticking out in that screenshot. I do not recall any other ship models being used other than the EEV and Sulaco in Alien 3...so...I'm not sure what else it could be.

[beckmen]

From a production standpoint? Most likely a matte painting.

I like NERMAL's idea the most, out of the ones raised.

[SM]

Well, the Patna wasn't even making a descent during the last shot we see it. I am not trying to argue that it is another ship, I am trying to argue that we don't know what it is. Knowing what we know about the production, it's possible not even Fincher and Company have an answer to that one.

No doubt the whole thing was slap dash.

However seeing as we've seen the Sulaco model in two previous shots, I don't see why they'd intend for it to be anything other than the rescue ship.

It also wouldn't surprise me if they shot the model for the landed shot.  The forward antenna to right of frame and the main hull to the left.

I did some quick research and couldn't find what they used exactly, but did read that the rescue ship lacks the big starboard and port side projections and gun turrets.  You can't tell in the film about the gun turrets but you can see the side projections missing.

The shot over the prison complex is the restored model with the projections (though they're not visible on DVD).

[public_78]

To me it makes no sense for a ship of that size to come down out of orbit.  Afterall, once an object is in orbit it only takes minor energy adjustments to keep it from descending.  Landing and takeoffs consume just as much energy now as they did 50 years ago.  I know this is not the 23rd century but even star trek avoided the bulkiness of landing on planets and opted for transporter technology. In Aliens Bishop stated that the second dropship had to be refueled.  Using a consumable energy source for the dropship tells me that its still more efficient to waste fuel than to bring the sulaco down to the surface.  Just my opinion.
I cant argue, my car does not get  15 light years to the gallon. lol

[SM]

And yet we see it clearly not in orbit.

Similarly Voyager made planetfall in a number of Trek episodes.